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River Swimming public forum--10-19-20VIDEO of October 20, 2020 swimming community forum https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEldRZPSZE4 CHAT conversation 00:17:41 celialang: how much influence do residents have with National Grid ? Should individuals go on record as requesting access changes? 00:26:34 Jane’s iPad: I think we need a tour of these sites,because it is not clear to me just where they are! 00:27:57 Carolyn Oppenheim: It is astonishing to me how much our government runs on grants……..this is the second call I’ve been on where Wayne has explained how much decision making depends on finding grants. 00:28:34 Larry Hott: Has there been a survey about demand for these areas? 00:35:10 Lora Sandhusen: agree with Kim ‐ swimming in unregulated areas is popular because it’s unregulated 00:35:56 Larry Hott: I agree. Musante Beach is fantastic. We could use more swimming areas. Please pursue grants to open up as many areas as possible. 00:41:34 Wendy Mardas: I'm the vice president of Northampton Community Rowing; our boathouse is in the Connecticut River Greenway Riverfront Park. We fully support broadening opportunities for swimming in Northampton, and we also share some of the same concerns that have already been mentioned. The river in this area sees heavy motor boat use in the summer, and with the huge increase in swimming from the beach, there are major safety issues. Would any potential expansion/improvement of the park include addressing the motor traffic on the river to reduce the risk to swimmers? 00:42:47 Kristen Elde: Yes. Thank you, Emily. 00:43:50 Lora Sandhusen: yes, swim, but don’t burn down r 00:43:58 sherylstoodley: Go Emily — you are so right on these points. 00:44:22 Oriana R (She/her): agree! never should have been privatized in the first place. so lets reallocate police money to the public works! 00:45:05 Kristin Pisano (she/her): Thank you, Emily. Spot on 00:45:56 Carolyn Oppenheim: There is also the cost of liability. Would the city have to have life guards there? 00:51:35 Connie Parks: Isn't the problem the fees at Musante? 00:53:24 Oriana R (She/her): musante fees are also a problem I agree^ i never go to a place I have to pay. so if money can be reallocated to fix that‐ also a good start in the meantime 00:55:06 Larry Hott: We need to pay for what we use. If the costs are prohibitive that’s unfair, but we pay for everything else — roads, police, sanitation ‐. Musante works because it has lifeguards, restrooms and water testing. I’d like to see lower fees so families can come without going broke, but fees are not inherently evil. 00:55:29 sherylstoodley: So you want to use the shift to Conservation land to use those rules to force out the undesirables from outside Northampton and get what you want that way. 00:55:40 David Velez: I love musante and for years was happy to pay for a family pass. well worth the investment and I saw it as supporting something I love. this year the $15/ visit was cost prohibitive, especially when one just wanted a quick dip. hoping we go back to regular rates. 00:56:05 Oriana R (She/her): Yeah Sheryl I also agree‐ i don't support conservation rules if they are going to criminalize more activities. 00:56:10 Emily Coffin: my question is why the parks and Rec department is self‐sustaining—seems inherently prohibitive 00:56:18 Larry Hott: David, agree completely. The $15.00 fee was ridiculous and pushed people to use other areas when that may not have been appropriate. 00:56:52 sherylstoodley: Agree with David’s point as well. 00:57:47 Oriana R (She/her): yes Emily again agree. We pay with our taxes. I don't want my tax money going to police so that I have to pay extra money to swim. i want my tax money to go to the swimming holes. 00:57:51 Carolynn Laurenza: Andrea I missed the name, where is the good water quality for swimming? 00:59:14 Jason: I don’t think i heard anyone say anything about forcing anyone out. The rules and ordinances on conservation land would help improve some of the negative issues associated with overuse. It will not help with sanitary issues, or trash collection. But those rules apply to everyone, not just visitors. People are not undesirable, some of their behavior is undesireable 00:59:28 iPhone: Yes. Need reasonable safeguards and yes.... rules.. an old fashioned word..simple as bring it in n take your trash with you. respect your neighbors.... our “ treasure “ is turning to trash. Looking at conservation rules is a good idea. 01:00:03 Ed Olmstead: In addition to Musante fees I wonder about the possibility of reducing fees at Look Park which has a spray park, play park and open space. 01:00:56 Emily Coffin: its not “our” treasure, this is Nipmuc and pocumtuc land 01:01:01 Andrea Donlon, CT River Conservancy: The good water quality location is the CT River at the DCR/UMASS docks just upstream of the Coolidge Bridge. Search online at https://connecticutriver.us/content/sites‐list. 01:01:24 Carolynn L: thank you! 01:01:36 David Velez: look park is private, town doesn’t control their fees. 01:02:00 Carolyn Oppenheim: Wayne, you left out liability. If the city is involved, aren’t we responsible. If someone drowns there, and sues Northampton…….. 01:02:40 Emily Coffin: Everything is radicalized on stolen land 01:02:47 Emily Coffin: racialized* 01:04:13 Dale West: I agree with a lot of what I have heard here. I think we need to maintain access opportunities and mitigate the negative consequences of use – such as trash and human waste. I think providing trash cans and restroom facilities near the Orange Dam would go a long way. These swimming holes are going to stay, and we can prioritize our city budget to address these in the short term. 01:04:19 Oriana R (She/her): I support non‐police stewardship, water quality testing and trash pick up. I don't support anything monitoring noise. I don't see any reason for that and think its racially coded and there is research on that. people aren't noisy at night, its only in the day and if people's joy is bothering you during the day‐ sorry but i don't think that's a real problem. I can talk a lot more about noise. 01:04:28 celia lang: In addition to online meetings like this, (thx) what other city dept. commitments to outreach and education are being considered to increase civic awareness and appreciation for good use for sustainability & behavior by all residents, visitors and the civic education of K to College age youth? 01:05:23 Connie Parks: Perhaps citizens could organize swimming hole clubs for outreach to public and stewardship with city for maintenance. River bank and floodplain need major ecorestoration. We deserve free access to all sites. 01:06:32 Jason: You know Emily, I don’t think anyone is ceding any land back to the original inhabitants. The city and state is involving paving over a 10,000 year old site though that could be preserved rather than turned into a roundabout. You may get some more traction there as far as respecting native communities. 01:07:08 Emily Coffin: i know that but lets not act like everything we do isn’t racialized 01:10:15 Jane’s iPad: I think the loud noise is not joy, but boom boxes blasting 01:10:41 Jason: This issue was racialized, which often leads to doing nothing…which is the last thing that needs to be done here. Rules and regulation of activities need to enforced across the board. Everyone needs places to cool off, not everyone respects the areas, people do not regulate themselves. 01:10:55 David Velez: got to run but thank you everyone for thinking about this and working to save our access. please publish follow up was to stay involved and connected. 01:12:03 John Sinton: 2 thoughts: Maines field has alot of room for more use. Was there quite a number of times this summer and it wasn’ttoo busy. It seems to me that since it’s already city it could be upgraded a little (bathroom)and put in trash collection. Add some kind of random monitoring of people using. 2) whatever we upgrade, people who want no monitoring will gravitate to the spaces not monitored. How to handle that. I think opening any and all spaces w can afford to monitor the better for quality of life for all. Wendy Sinton 01:12:04 iPhone: Nipmuc and Pocumtuc would be sad to see the treatment of their land and wouldn’t tolerate the abuse and disrespect of the river. Throw some charcoal into it, mix it with trash, add big noise that your neighbors and I think our native Americans would be disgusted with the treatment of their land. 01:13:20 Oriana R (She/her): boom boxes are joy 01:13:39 Dale West: I agree with Jamie. I think the popularity of these areas are not going to decrease. If we give people the opportunity to do what's right, they will. 01:14:41 Rachel Maiore: Wayne, can you speak to potential municipal support for River Stewards? 01:15:04 Ed Olmstead: Yes, to the other woman on Jamie's screen. Education is better than policing, which is currently one way these areas are being managed. 01:15:31 Kristin Pisano (she/her): So well said Jamie and Rachel! As a Leeds resident, avid swimmer, parent, and educator, I agree that the stewardship piece is key. 01:16:02 Jason: They have the opportunity to do right every time the come Dale. Some do some don’t, what opportunities are you suggesting thats going to change behavior? 01:16:07 Rachel Maiore: Agree, Kristin! 01:16:19 sherylstoodley: Why isn’t the River Steward concept the one to truly look into. Making up a new set of rules will not solve this decades long problem. We are talking about cultural differences and a Steward can address these. Np Parking signs and No Trespassing signs solve nothing and sends the wrong message. 01:16:22 Dale West: Trash cans, Jason. 01:16:25 karen: Yes, Thank you Jamie and Rachel for your perspective 01:16:32 iPhone: Stewardship , ownership constructive management and yes share the cost is a reality. River stewards have been many Leeds residents that have welcomed and cleaned n picked up unmentionables for years n years. It’s become unmanageable w the crowds 01:16:55 Lynne Shapiro: Clear Falls was mentioned but only very briefly. That's where I went when I first moved to town a long time ago, when there was a day use fee. Is that in any way a future option? I don't even know where most of the places here are. 01:17:37 Jason: The city is not going to maintain trashcans. Who is going to pay for it? 01:17:40 Oriana R (She/her): yes expand and also enhance access to existing. Both! 01:18:01 Dale West: I'm saying the city SHOULD maintain trash cans. 01:18:30 Denise McKahn: Please add trash cans in select spaces and put maintenance on a contract with pedal people. We pay for pedal people to pick up trash downtown. Cost of trash pickup is minimal compared to the impact on neighbors. 01:18:38 Rachel Maiore: Trash cans are cheaper than police. 01:18:41 Jane’s iPad: yes, Wendy. 01:18:51 #: I would love to see bike and ped access considered for Nohamp crew beach! 01:19:01 Rachel Maiore: Thanks, Wendy! 01:20:28 sherylstoodley: Steward needs to be bilingual and sensitive to cultural differences. 01:20:56 Dale West: if it's a cost issue, we need to realign our priorities. 01:21:07 Oriana R (She/her): agree with Rachel‐ if cost is the issue then spend the $600,000! there is no way trash cans cost that much 01:21:11 karen: Is trash pick up more expensive than the traffic enforcement and cost of police? 01:21:12 celia lang: It all should be “carry in ‐ carry out.” People should be responsible for their own trash. Need civic education 01:21:46 karen: There could be a composting tolet 01:22:16 Rachel Maiore: Right, Karen. 01:23:18 Jason: Are you bringing solutions like this to Council Rachael ? We haven’t heard any solution oriented ideas from you in 5 months. 01:23:47 karen: I think a combination of education regarding carry in/carry out and trash cans would be a possibility 01:24:20 Ed Olmstead: I think that sanitary facilities should be considered in popular public areas. Shifting costs to preventative measure generally rather than reacting to conditions after the fact seems like it could be of benefit to all. 01:24:43 John Sinton: THANK YOU, WAYNE! 01:24:57 Connie Parks: Lack of public restrooms is number one impediment to tourism in Western Mass. We favor bike/ped access over cars. Composting toilets ‐‐ make the state let us try them. 01:24:59 Rachel Maiore: Yes: Thanks, Wayne. 01:25:01 Amy Bookbinder: Jason, looks like you haven’t been listening for 5 months. 01:25:04 Wendy Mardas: Thank you, Wayne! 01:25:20 celia lang: Thank you. Good presentation and conversation. I think the City depth should being do more like this on many issues 01:25:30 Connie Parks: Please Wayne never retire! 01:26:07 Chris Kitzmiller: Increased sanitary facilities may be a a draw for a lot of swimmers. This may be an opportunity for the city to draw swimmers to more manageable sites. 01:26:20 Norma: The Deerfield River manages with Port‐a‐Potties, maybe there's an example there to look at. 01:27:32 Jane’s iPad: where on the Deerfield? 01:27:51 Andrea Donlon, CT River Conservancy: Not sure what Deerfield River site you mean, but at Zoar Picnic area, that is supplied by the power company that owns Bear Swamp pumped storage/Fife Brook Dam, and they are required to do it as part of their FERC license. 01:28:02 Lora Sandhusen: Thank you for the professionalism and thoughtfulness in this discussion. Very reassuring. 01:28:58 Andrea Donlon, CT River Conservancy: There are other high‐use areas on the Deerfield that have no sanitation ‐‐ Shunpike, for example. This area was turned into "live parking" only this summer due to huge crowds. 01:31:41 Oriana R (She/her): well said claire 01:31:48 Dale West: Yes ‐ thank you Claire. 01:31:50 Connie Parks: Need to address water quality degradation from pet waste, likely cause of harmful cyanobacterial blooms in Magnolia and Triangle Ponds. Curb your dog ‐‐avoid biohazards. 01:31:52 karen: Thank you Claire 01:31:53 ya‐ping douglass: agreed thank you Claire! 01:32:06 Rachel Maiore: Good point, Claire. 01:32:42 sherylstoodley: Excellent points Claire. 01:33:52 karen: Can you post the url of that site Wayne? 01:34:08 Rachel Maiore: I love that idea, Linda! 01:34:21 Connie Parks: Get rid of snow dump next to river at Maib 01:35:01 Connie Parks: at Maines Field. 01:38:37 Wayne Feiden: Our files for this project will all be at http://archive.northamptonit.info/WebLink/Browse.aspx?id=690657&dbid=0&repo=CityOfN orthampton 01:39:12 karen: Thank you Wayne 01:40:10 Chris Kitzmiller: Thank you for this forum. This was an excellent opportunity to hear from the community. :)